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[FEN ""]

1.e4 e5 2.Nc3 Bc5 3.Na4 Bxf2+

For those of you who never heard of Hamppe-Meitner. Now I dimly remember that a super engine somewhere found a White win, but even the bringer of the news ceded that a super-duper engine could reverse that. (See e.g. here for the complete game and how they still discuss...)

Can you link me to a human-annotated (a mere list with cryptical "+0.5 after Kj9" is quite useless, see below) computer analysis, also with evaluations of the side variants? Mustn't be each and any move, but at least the sensible ones, if one can talk of sensible in that crazy positions...)

The greater plan is to turn it into a Euwe-style "I test myself" test for the chess kids I train, to boost their imagination. Of course I must deliver when I get asked why Kj9 botches the draw!

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  • 4
    I don't understand the question.
    – SmallChess
    Commented Feb 4, 2022 at 10:26
  • youtube.com/watch?v=LZ9iia2aIQc at about 6:30 might be what you are talking about, where it says an engine has white with an advantage of about a pawn in a side line, but it doesn't go into depth, and it's not entirely clear to me what you want anyway.
    – Ian Bush
    Commented Feb 4, 2022 at 13:27
  • 1
    What is Kj9? My chessboard only has files from a to h.
    – SecretAgentMan
    Commented Feb 4, 2022 at 13:33
  • 1
    @SecretAgentMan: Kj9 is a joke. Read "any move".
    – Hauke Reddmann
    Commented Feb 5, 2022 at 16:25
  • @HaukeReddmann forgive me. I am an idiot.
    – SecretAgentMan
    Commented Feb 22, 2022 at 18:49

3 Answers 3

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You might want to go with http://www.kenilworthchessclub.org/games/java/2009/hamppe-meitner.htm however no guarantees on its being up to date.

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  • by the way, 8. d4 and 9. d4 might be the bone crushers you mentioned.
    – starrin
    Commented Feb 4, 2022 at 13:04
  • This appears not up to date, running it through Leela it immediately finds improvements for both sides. :D For instance it is stated that after Kc3 d4+ is a mistake which does not appear to be the case, rather after d4+ Kb3 Qxe4 Black seems to have more than sufficient compensation for the piece.
    – koedem
    Commented Feb 5, 2022 at 6:32
  • This would be indeed a great resource, style-wise, with extensive analysis and alternatives...were it not for the fact that the analysis is outdated :-) Too bad. But for training, it probably will do, since none of my chess kids runs on Leela and they have to believe me :-)
    – Hauke Reddmann
    Commented Feb 5, 2022 at 16:36
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Using Stockfish 14 at depth up to 25 I find:

4 Kxf2 (Ke2? Bxg1! 5 Rxg1 d5 {-6.3}) Qh4+
5 Ke3 (g3 Qxe4! 6 Qe1/Qe2 Qxh1 7 Qxe5+ Kf8
  (Ne7? 8 Nf3! {+1.3}) 8 Bg2/Qxc7 {-0.2}) Qf4+
6 Kd3 d5
7 Qe1 (Kc3 d4+ 8 Kb3 Qxe4 {-0.9} (Be6+? 9 c4! {+0.4})) Nf6
8 g3 dxe4+ (Qg4 9 c3 {+0.1})
9 Kc3 Nd5+ 10 Kb3 Qf6 11 c4 b5 (Nc6)
12 cxb5 (cxd5? bxa4+! {-0.9}) Nd7 {-0.7}

[fen "rnbqk1nr/pppp1ppp/8/4p3/N3P3/8/PPPP1bPP/R1BQKBNR w - - 0 4"]

4. Kxf2 (4. Ke2? Bxg1! 5. Rxg1 d5 {-6.3}) Qh4+ 5. Ke3 (5. g3 Qxe4! 6. Qe1 (6. Qe2 Qxh1) Qxh1 7. Qxe5+ Kf8 (7...Ne7? 8. Nf3! {+1.3}) 8. Bg2 (8. Qxc7) {-0.2}) Qf4+ 6. Kd3 d5 7. Qe1 (7. Kc3 d4+ 8. Kb3 Qxe4 {-0.9} (8...Be6+? 9. c4! {+0.4})) Nf6 8. g3 dxe4+ (8...Qg4 9. c3 {+0.1}) 9. Kc3 Nd5+ 10. Kb3 Qf6 11. c4 b5 (11...Nc6) 12. cxb5 (12. cxd5? bxa4+! {-0.9}) Nd7 {-0.7}

Figures are evaluations in terms of advantage to White in pawns. These are rough --- different evaluations might give slightly different figures.

If there is a line by which White can guarantee a winning position, Stockfish can't find it at that depth. I get the impression that Stockfish reckons that Black has a slight advantage.

365chess.com's openings-database rates 3 Na4 Bxf2+ at -1.00, and says that it is very rare: only 28 3 Na4 games of which 24 are 3 Na4 Bxf2+, compared to 551 for 3 Bc4. Game totals are of games in its big database.

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  • Thanks. I've corrected the move numbering (our replayer understands full FEN with the move number specified), and restored a copy of the notation in plain text. The replayer has some nice features but looks wretched for those of us who are visually impaired and need to use dark mode (all squares are dark and black pawns are invisible) and/or low resolution (either the moves aren't shown or they are shown below the board, so the navigation controls and board can't be shown on screen at the same time).
    – Rosie F
    Commented Feb 5, 2022 at 6:35
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I'm not completely sure about your question, but if you're trying to find a win for one side in the game, there were 5 critical positions, 2 for black and 3 for white, in which they could have won the game.

Black initially had a critical position after 7.Kc3 and could have responded with the winning d4+.

Black plays 7...Qxe5 instead, giving white a winning position after white plays 8.d4.

White blunders back, playing 8.Kb3, allowing black to win after he plays 8...d4.

White is also winning after Black played 8...Na6 after 9.d4.

Lastly, after Black played 11...Nc5+, White can win with 12.Kb5.

Four of the five critical positions in this game revolve pushing the pawn to the d4 square.

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